Teddy's Actions

My son's NAA Guardian .380 is finicky about what he feeds it. It seems to operate best on Win Silvertip Hollow Points or most brands of ball ammo.
BUT and this is a big BUT, no matter what he feeds it, it will stovepipe the last round in the magazine, every time.
It's his wife's carry piece and he is concerned about it's reliability. I have searched other forums and it seems a lot of other folks experience the same problem.
Any one out there know of a possible fix for this or does it have to make a trip back to the factory?
:banghead: :cuss: :fire:

I have a Guardian in .32, and it does the same thing(randomly though, not always on the last round). I sent it back to the factory, they did some polishing, spring replacement, etc, and it still does the same thing, except with Silver tip. I gave up and just carry a revolver now.

I encountered the same situation and also found that the magazine release was easy to push on firing dropping it. Thankfully, it was not my pistol. I was shooting ball ammo. Byron

Master Chief,

These little guns operate that way pretty much all the time as they do not have ejectors. When the extractor pulls the fired casing from the chamber, the live round underneath, contained within the magazine, moves upward under pressure from the magazine spring, thus, helping push the fired casing up as the extractor pulls it out. When the last round is fired, there is not a round in the magazine to push against the fired casing, which, commonly, gets stuck in a classic stovepipe malfunction. The condition is inherent to the gun based on its simplicity of design.

I have a Guardian in .32 ACP. Rarely, the last casing will eject, but more commonly it gets caught between the slide breechface and the chamber. I don't worry about it for two reasons. First, I don't expect to be performing speed reloads should I actually need to use it. If things have degraded to the point I'm using this gun, I am at that stage of empty the mag in their ear and run away. Second, I have practiced clearing the stoppage, just as I would with my duty weapon, and have had no problems in ejecting the spent casing, and then switching the empty magazine for a full one. These are nice little guns, and I have had no problem with mine through hundreds of rounds, and four years of carry and practice. I hope this helps.

Sincerely,

Michael

MICHAEL, Thanks for the very informative answer, I sincerely appreciate it.
His problem is slightly different from what you have experienced, his will not feed the last live cartridge, number six in the magazine.
If it were my gun, I would do as you have done and learn to deal with the problem. On the other hand, it's his wife's carry piece so I think I'll recommend to him to sell or trade the NAA and find a light weight S&W or Taurus .38 SPL revolver for her.
Again I thank you very much for the info.

From http://www.naaminis.com/naagdfaq.html

I have read/experienced that the case from the last spent round occasionally gets stuck between the slide and the frame. Is this a product 'failure'? Should I be concerned?

No, frankly, not at all. Yes, we are aware of, and understand the causes of, this condition. Yes, it is not an uncommon occurrence. No, we do not believe it represents a performance failure and we do not intend to try to 'correct' the condition.

The design of this pistol does not include an ejector (not to be confused with an extractor), but relies on the following action of a fresh cartridge, as it is moving up the magazine stack and towards the chamber, to push the spent extracted case out of the breech. When the magazine is empty and there is no following cartridge to exert this pressure, the spent case may simply be trapped by the slide returning forward (the slide is not designed to remain open after the last round).

When a full magazine is inserted to replace the empty one, the slide must, in any/every event ('stovepipe' or not) be re-racked to chamber a fresh round. During this process, the spent case simply falls freely out of the breech and the pistol returns to battery - as though the condition had never existed. (Please note that we are not attempting to excuse any stovepipe of a live round. If that condition exists with any of our pistols, we will be happy to rework the gun to eliminate that failure).

For what it is worth, NAA will not acept it for waranty work on a last round stove pipe as they consider it part of the design as mentioned above. I have both the .32 and .380. I don't carry a reload when I carry it so it doesn't bother me but if I did, all I would have to do is drop the magazine, insert a new one and rack the slide just like normal and it clears itself. SO for me it is a non issue. While I respect that this is not confidence inspiring. I think that is based on experiences with other handguns and practice would overcome any hesitation about the design. But obviously there is nothing more important than someone's love one and if they want to change obviously the should do it.

I have a Guardian .380 since last May. Bought it new. During the initial break in period I had all kinds of not feeding and stove piping problems. But it only happened with PMC ammo. After about 50 - 60 rounds those problems went away and since then it has fed Hollow points and FMJs just fine and never has given me the stove piping at the last round problem. I have shot a little over 200 rounds through it and have not had any issues with it since.

MATT SUTTON, If you are a company rep for NAA your attitude sucks!!!!
People pay over $400 for a compact pistol they should be able to feel confident that it will work as advertised. Where does it say in your published owner's manual that the last spent casing will probably stovepipe and that's an OK normal condition. You say you are aware of the problem, why don't you try to fix it?
I won't trust an NAA Semi-auto as far as I can throw one and if your attitude is representative of the company you work for then I shall do all I know how to do to get the word out that your product does not live up to it's advertising and that The Guardian series is a poor investment. We bought your product because it was made in the USA, dam shame that off shore products perform better than yours. Even the little guy, Kel-Tec, will at least try to fix their problems but you say you have no intention of trying to fix your guns problems. You don't have to be a gunsmith to figure out that Kel-Tec is a better investment than NAA.
You say you have no intention of trying to correct the problem and that you don't intend to stand behind your product? Well then who do I have to speak to to get my $440 back, certainly not you I hope!
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NAA DOES NOT CARE - DON'T YOU GET IT BY NOW
THEY HAVE KNOWN ABOUT THIS INFERIOR DESIGN FOR YEARS.